DIALOGUE OF A POST-SEPTEMBER 11 HUMANIST WITH THE WORLD 
by John Desrochers, csc

Humanist: I feel so insecure after September 11. All kinds of fears grow within me: travelling by plane, train or bus, frequenting public places, becoming the victim of anthrax, etc.

World: The world's 1.2 billion people who live on less than $ (US) 1 a day have always experienced insecurity! And how secure do the Israelis and the Palestinians feel, and the bombed Afghans, the Kashmiris, the Indian/Pakistani soldiers at the border, and the immigrants and minorities everywhere? What about the abused children, the raped women, the 260 million Dalits...?

H: Yes, so many people are more insecure than I am. But now insecurity has invaded my own life!

W: As long as individuals and nations are more concerned about their own security than that of others, there won't be much peace and security! India and Pakistan should be concerned about each other's and the Kashmiris' security. George Bush and Osama bin Laden must ensure each other's security!

H: Please, be realistic!

W: The world has no future under realism. People must make dreams become real. Terrorism will continue to spread insecurity till food security and socio-economic, political and cultural rights are not ensured. Significant breakthroughs in all fields are imperative!

The Horror of Terrorism

H: Terrorism is terrible: 6,000-7,000 innocent people died almost instantly in New York and Washington.

W: That's true, but remember, the history of most countries is filled with horror and terror: destruction or enslavement of indigenous peoples, oppression of minorities and ethnic or racial groups, culturo-religious conflicts and persecutions, caste, colonialism and so on. And millions of women are terrorised in their own homes!

H: But most of this is invisible or forgotten! It does not strike us so much...

W: This does not make the horror less real! The recent American record is particularly awesome: "nuclear bombing of civilians in Hiroshima/Nagasaki, use of chemical weapons in Vietnam where over 2 million civilians were killed, sanctions in Iraq resulting in the deaths of 1.2 million people of whom 500,000 were children",¹ retaliatory bombing of Sudan after the attacks on US Embassies in East Africa, murderous operations in Chile, Nicaragua, Guatemala and many other countries, installation of puppet regimes in Iran, Indonesia, Nigeria and Somalia, which killed thousands of innocent civilians.

H: You sound anti-American!

W: I am against people's suffering and oppression everywhere, not against Americans!

H: Vandana Shiva broadens the concepts of terrorism and violence. She speaks of starvation deaths in Kashipur, Orissa as "the result of waves of violence against nature and the tribal communities, of the ecological plunder of the resources of the region, the dismantling of the food security system under the economic reform policies and the impact of climate change which caused crop failures". Nowadays, a new wave of terror is unleashed by the giant aluminum mining companies who want to take over the tribals' homelands. "This forced apportioning of resources is a form of terrorism too - corporate terrorism."

W: I'm glad you sometimes read articles which make you think! What else does she write?

H: According to her, the 50 million people who have been displaced by development in independent India "are also the victims of terrorism: they have faced the terror of technology and destructive development". For "the millions who will die when flood and drought and cyclones become more severe because of climate change and fossil fuel pollution", George Bush "is an ecological terrorist because he refuses to sign the Kyoto protocol. The WTO was named the World Terrorist Organisation by citizens in Seattle because its rules denied millions the right to life and livelihood."² But can we truly speak of terrorism in such cases?

W: I don't care about words and appellations when people are suffering and dying! Now, 2 to 3 million Afghan refugees face the spectre of starvation. Is terrorism the greatest evil? Is it worse than maintaining people in poverty and dependence, and exploiting them for years on end?

H: But terrorism will pose greater dangers in the future if nuclear, chemical and biological weapons are used. People feel so helpless at the turn of events.

W: If they knew all the threats endangering humanity, they would feel even more terrified and helpless.

The Concept of Terrorism

W: Since you seem interested in this question, how would you define terrorism?

H: Terrorism should first be distinguished from full-scale wars or even guerrilla warfare, where small armies use hit-and-run tactics. It also goes beyond selective assassinations. Terrorism is characterised by the deliberate and indiscriminate killing of innocent civilians.

W: Thus defined, terrorism is certainly totally wrong and indefensible - everywhere and by anybody! But don't many civilians also die due to wars? Is "collateral damage" so blameless, especially when all precautions are not really taken? Moreover, civilians often become involved in resistance movements and freedom struggles. Isn't the precise borderline between terrorism and war/resistance difficult to establish? Most nations denounce terrorists, but few agree on their identity and the best ways to combat them.

H: Even the UN Security Council failed to offer a clear-cut definition. The main problem lies in distinguishing real terrorists from resistance/freedom fighters, the "terrorists with a cause".

W: But don't most terrorists have a cause? Who is to justify or reject their reasons? A country's terrorists are often another country's freedom fighters! Look at Kashmir, Tibet, Chechnya, Sri Lanka. How can one distinguish on the basis of "cause" or "intention"?

H: Why not then justify or condemn all terrorists? This would mean either encouraging struggles and fighting everywhere, or supporting the status quo everywhere! One would thus have to say with the Americans that there are no "good terrorists", or with bin Laden (if he was logical) that there are no "bad terrorists". But the latter only claims that he is a "good terrorist"!

W: There is great danger in letting the leaders of the world and the existing governments decide who are the real terrorists. All anti-government forces will then be declared terrorist, and all government forces anti-terrorist. And this, when state terrorism is the most dangerous!

H: Bomb people's prejudices, not the Afghans! Why should those who put bombs in trains, buses or market places be labelled "terrorists" and those who drop them from planes be praised as "defenders of civilisational values"? Is it because the latter also drop food packets and have money to influence the mass media?

W: Stop joking about important matters! What is clear is that the most important step (and perhaps the only solution) is not to define terrorism but to identify and eliminate its causes.

The Causes of Terrorism

W: Something worries me much more than terrorism!

H: Don't belittle terrorism! What are you talking about?

W: My greatest worry is that so little attention is paid to the root causes of terrorism, its breeding ground or seed!

H: It is easier to look for Osama in the caves of Afghanistan than to unearth societal evils! And easier still to drop bombs than heal individuals and nations!

W: Hardly anybody speaks of the arms race and the need for controlling the weapons of terrorism - be they chemical, biological, nuclear or conventional.

H: You see, business interests are at stake! Several 'First World' countries sell arms and buy drugs, while some 'Third World' countries buy arms and sell drugs. This is part of the former's 'civilisational superiority' the Italian PM boasts about!

W: Be serious and think a bit. There is a still deeper cause. The attacks on the World Trade Centre and the Pentagon complex would probably not have occurred "if the US had adopted an even-handed approach in the Arab-Israel conflict, agreed to the lifting of the punitive sanctions on Iraq, pulled its forces out of the Gulf and pressed allied Arab leaders to reform their inefficient and corrupt administrations."³

H: Who can resolve the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and transform corrupt and repressive governments?!

W: It is not only a question of American policies. Terrorism becomes almost unstoppable when terrorists represent and champion large groups of people who feel deprived or wronged, especially by external agencies or powers, and "helpless to do anything except resort to terror". The use of force against such terrorists without eliminating their sources of legitimacy only creates more recruits to the cause of indiscriminate violence.⁴

H: Can we not then say that terrorism arises from people's helplessness, frustration and despair? Is it not the cry of the poor and the oppressed, the ultimate and desperate effort of the voiceless to be heard?

W: Look at today's world, the massive poverty and socio-economic inequalities, the striking injustices afflicting minorities, women and children, the revolting oppression of Dalits and Tribals, the senseless destruction of the environment for the sake of profit...

H: We must moreover recognise the growing hatred and intolerance of our times. The destruction of the Bamian Buddha statues, the demolition of the Babri mosque, the attack on the World Trade Centre and many ethnic conflicts reflect the same pattern.⁵

W: Ervin Laszlo was better at predicting the future than Nostradamus! He wrote in 1977: "Unless current patterns of socio-economic growth and development are modified, the world may be heading for catastrophe. The gap between rich and poor nations will widen, the poorest will be unable to survive, and mounting pressures will erupt into acts of terrorism and ultimately war."⁶

H: There are many such prophets today, but who listens?! It is so difficult for the rich and powerful, or primordial/natural groups based on religion, culture, language, tribe or caste, to acknowledge and give up their vested interests and collective follies.

W: Nowadays, everybody condemns global terrorism, but there is as much or more terrorism within countries and communities, feeding on similar causes.

H: What rights have indeed the destroyers of the Babri mosque to denounce cross-border terrorism in Kashmir? India may one day lose much more than Kashmir because it is forgetting its pluralism and neglecting the poor!

W: The caste system is probably the greatest source of terror in the world...

H: Yet, the media do not speak much of the sufferings of the Dalits and low castes. For them, some lives are much more important than others!

W: The advocates of non-violence often speak of the peaceful means available to redress injustices. But are these means truly within the reach of the poor and the oppressed? How can they radically redistribute wealth and power between and within countries?

H: It would be much simpler if the naxalities, maoists and bin Ladens of this world would commit suicide like the Indian farmers who cannot repay their debts! Or would the Indian farmers have a greater impact by becoming terrorists?

W: I don't justify indiscriminate violence, but we must understand its dynamics. The structural violence manifested in various types of poverty, inequalities and injustices often leads, sooner or later, to revolutionary and even terrorist violence.

H: True enough! But don't you feel for the innocent victims?

W: I have compassion for all victims - whatever may be their racial/ethnic, national or culturo-religious background, and whatever may be the forms of violence they are subjected to: gender, economic, social, political or ideological. I feel for all victims, even if they are not so innocent, and whether they react 'normally', or become depressed and suicidal or angry, violent and terrorist.

H: With all this compassion, you won't be a 'good' terrorist! By the way, so many countries want a say in the formation of the post-Taliban regime in Afghanistan. Is this not an interference in the internal affairs of another nation?!

The Forgotten Wars

H: Isn't the world's situation hopeless?

W: Hey, you sound discouraged and almost suicidal!

H: Stop joking and answer me!

W: In focussing on the war on terrorism, the world will get lost in definitions and debates. This war will further divide humanity, cause endless tensions and give birth to numberless terrorists. The only possible gain may be the realisation that there can be no victors but only victims. Hope this happens soon!

H: So, what is your message to bin Laden and Bush, Blair and Omar, Arafat and Sharon, Musharraf and Vajpayee?

W: I have just one message for all of them! Focus on the forgotten wars! Focus on the war on all types of poverty, inequalities and injustice; the war on all forms of discrimination, marginalisation and oppression; and the war against all sources of hatred and intolerance among people.

H: This would be quite a war! The "mother of all wars", as Saddam Hussein would say! In your list of "forgotten wars", don't forget the war against corruption, caste and the new colonialism of globalisation, and the war for Dalit human rights!

W: I want to tell the world leaders to focus on the war to build a better and more just, egalitarian, peaceful and fraternal world; the war to protect the environment and save Mother Earth; the war to promote communal harmony, universal and humane development, gender equality, human rights, diversity and pluralism, more participatory structures of decision-making at all levels, and a genuine world government and community of nations; in short, the war to ensure human dignity everywhere and build a new humanity free of terrorism.

H: So, after all, you are for war! We will need quite an alliance! Hardly anyone takes such wars seriously! Why can't nations give the same importance to these wars as to the war on terrorism? Why don't they make the funds available to create a world alliance which will eliminate the very causes of terrorism and thus the need for a war on terrorism?

The Challenge of Terrorism

H: What do you think of people praying for victory over their enemies?

W: Does God have enemies? God, She has only children, not enemies! She must be laughing at so many of our prayers, or rather she must have mercy on our foolishness, or be doing both at the same time!

H: Tell me frankly, do you totally reject the war on terrorism?

W: As you said earlier, we must be realistic. There is war and again there is war. Financial, diplomatic, legal and defensive military initiatives are certainly needed. Some restricted offensive interventions against terrorist groups and their supporters may even be called for.

H: Now, it appears you are neither pro-American nor pro-Osama!

W: I am pro-people, always and everywhere! I am thus against a full-scale war which creates humanitarian disasters, destroys many innocent lives and promotes antagonism between countries and religions. Extreme caution and restraint should be exercised, and the focus must be on the most needed but forgotten wars.

H: Soon after Sept. 11, a Gallup poll found that in 35 of 38 covered countries, less than 50% of the respondents called for military action against the perpetrators. (In all these countries, the majority simply favoured extradition.) The countries who did were the US (54%), Israel (77%) and India (72%)!⁷

W: By the way, what are the most meaningful passages you read in the recent debate on terrorism?

H: Two sentences struck me most. The first is a supposedly well-known quotation of Mahatma Gandhi, which I had not heard of before! "An eye for an eye will make the whole world blind." The second is a reply of the boxer Muhammad Ali. When asked how he felt about the terrorist suspects sharing his Islamic faith, he responded: "How do you feel about Hitler sharing yours?"⁸

W: For my part, I was particularly impressed by a passage from Vandana Shiva. "On 18th Sept.", she said, "I joined millions of Indians to observe a two-minute silence at 10.30 am, for those who lost their lives in the assault on the World Trade Centre and the Pentagon. But I also thought of the millions who are the victims of other terrorist actions and other forms of violence. And I renewed my commitment to resist violence in all its forms."⁹

H: Why do you find this statement so thought-provoking and inspiring?

W: It expresses the basic challenge of terrorism very well. Each one of us must become involved in the struggle against terrorism. Our contribution is essential and most important. The events of Sept. 11 and the US attacks in Afghanistan challenge each of us: "Can you become more committed to the cause of building a better society? Can you do more for the poor and the oppressed of this world? Can you live compassion, justice and peace in a more meaningful way today? Can you help to eradicate the causes of terrorism, at least in your surroundings?"

H: Hey, it seems I'm not as helpless as I thought! All of us can make a unique and indispensable contribution! This realisation is most welcome as the New Year 2002 approaches - a time when we try to take meaningful resolutions. Christians moreover celebrate the birth of Christ on 25th December, and nothing would please their friends more than their renewed and greater dedication to the birth of a new society.

W: People of all and no religions must join in this commitment. There is genuine hope, for the concern for justice, freedom, solidarity, peace and human dignity is growing in today's world.

NOTES

1. Achin Vanaik, The Hindu, 26/9/2001/12. 2. Vandana Shiva, ibid., 22/9/2001/13. 3. Michael Jansen, Deccan Herald, 29/9/2001/1. 4. Editorial, Economic and Political Weekly, 22/9/2001, 3569. 5. Hiral Rao, Deccan Herald, 23/9/2001/II. 6. Ervin Laszlo, "Goals for Mankind, A Report to the Club of Rome", Hutchinson, London, 1977, 301. 7. C.R. Reddy, The Hindu, 7/10/2001/III. 8. Reddy, op. cit. 9. Shiva, op. cit.

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* The humanist of this dialogue is a slightly naïve middle-class person, though imbued with deep universalist and social concerns. Today's world is given a voice expressing its aspirations for the best possible development of mother Earth and all her children, especially the poorest and most oppressed. This essay was finalised before the entry of the Northern Alliance in Kabul. The author thanks Cynthia Stephen and Mary Christina Rani Peter, who made several good contributions to this article. Readers are invited to send their views and join the author's search for justice and peace, truth and wisdom.

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